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Office 2K10

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  • Office 2K10

    Any way to get rid of the annoying "ribbons" and toolbars and get some menus back?

  • #2
    You can minimize the ribbon (right-click in the menu bar), but the old menus are gone, leaving Office programs far less productive (to me at least). The other thing you can do is to add specific commands to the "quick access toolbar".

    Alt-key combinations still work but you have to go through a lot longer chain of keys to get to what you want.

    All-in-all an abortion of an interface.


    • #3
      All to make the damn thing look less threatening.

      Now you have BIG ICONS!!!!!! WOOOOOOO!!!!!!

      Thanks Sab.


      • #4
        As with most of the employees I've spoken with, the new graphical section is actually well-laid-out, you just need to give it some time and work with it. There is a logic flow to the graphical layout - the start bubble is the old "File" menu. Then you have all of your tabs that replace the other menus, and rather than a list of words, you get a list of functional pictures with the most commonly used items/categories. It's all still there...

        Like I said, just takes some getting used to and a somewhat open mind. I still get frustrated from time to time trying to find a really obscure item, but when I do I'm like, "aha! that makes sense that it's there!"

        I actually am starting to prefer the new layout. The same venom you seem to have is the venom I had when I was forced to transfer from Win98 -> WinXP. I didn't like the new graphical-heavy layout, or where they hid/renamed some stuff. Then I had issues again on going from WinXP->Win7. But, the more I look, the more it makes sense, the harder it is to F*** things up.

        I will say this though .... I thought that MacOS was overdone and bloated ... I'm actually starting to like it more than Win7. Someone shoot me
        Where's my redeemer? INCOMING! I'M HIT! I'MA COMIN' BACK!
        Originally posted by Ranshackle
        I like Hasselhoff's ass better.


        • #5
          Shift - its the kind of venom you would expect from carpenters if all new screws were produced with the opposite thread, or from drivers if suddenly all cars in America had the gas pedal moved to the other side of the brake.

          There may be reasons for the change, and some of them might be considered "good", but ultimately the reason for the change is one word: Marketing (which implies the ultimate factor: Profit)

          MS needed to differentiate its products from the competition (such as Open Office) and since they couldn't really do that in terms of features, all they have left to change to set their products apart from the competition (and their own previous versions) is the interface. The change is about selling more of their thing. Period


          • #6
            What would have been very simple would have been a few things:

            1. Option to minimize the size of some of these icons. I am not blind (yet) and I do not need a square icon 4X the size of the old ones to tell me where the Chart Wizard is.

            2. Siimply keeping the old text menu (with customization options) on top of the "new and improved" menu. I agree that they may have optomized some of the work flow, but when you have your own toolbars already made and are used to finding certain things in certain places, "optimization" can be more than just a little ironic.

            The key is to integrate, not alienate. XL 2K7/2010 should not be a different operational animal than 2K3. we are not going from the old WP5 to a genuine GUI here.....


            • #7
              Stay tuned, they're already working on integrating the ribbon into Windows 8.



              • #8
                @Sab, I don't think it's as radical of a change as that. Perhaps they changed the screw to remove half the threads, or do two rows of threads, one shallow and one deep (like a TapCon) and put a hex head on top of them. It's not as offensive to me, however, as Apple's habit of planned obsolesence, and swapping connector shapes, sizes, interfaces every 2-3 years so you need to go buy new stuff.

                I've been the first one to ***** at the old MyU forum about Microsoft's penchant for training people one way to do things for a couple of versions, then totally changing it on them. It's like pulling a rug out. But the reality is, the changes are centered solidly in usability and productivity - a company can sit in the dark and accept they "always get it right the first time" or "it's good enough"; Microsoft doesn't do that.

                At some point you need to realize that everything is moving away from text-only and needs to be designed in a way that it can be operated with a keyboard AND a touchscreen, for the sake of the future. Sometimes that requires a total wipe and redesign. Or did you guys not add future tech into the equation when bashing on the 2007/2010 versions of MSO?

                In short, I'd rather have innovation than stale tech. Stale tech is what kept Linux in the closet for so long... and now, with teams like Ubuntu having come on the scene and start working on usability and productivity, it's actually something nearly anyone can install and use.

                @Hedge, come talk to me when you spend the next decade of your life studying and working heavily in the usability/user experience realm. It's something I was forced into from 1999-2004, and something I still occasionally deal with to this day. Your suggestions are ideal for you, but they are not ideal for (potentially) 51% or more of the rest of the world.

                When you do things like leave archaic text menus in place while including the new graphical UI, you only lend to clutter and confuse. The goal is to provide the user an opportunity to have an intuitive interface with minimal learning curve and limited clutter/confusion while still having multiple possible methods to accomplish the same goal (hotkeys, clicks and shortcuts, etc.)
                Where's my redeemer? INCOMING! I'M HIT! I'MA COMIN' BACK!
                Originally posted by Ranshackle
                I like Hasselhoff's ass better.


                • #9
                  That's the thing shift. You do not leave them, you leave the option.

                  Just like with the classic start menu.

                  I do not think, for a minute, that their placement of items makes much sense, but the text menu is easier sometimes to go looking in than a bunch of differently shaped icons in an organic arrangement on the top bar.

                  So instead of a narrow two liner where I plunked my own icons, I get a 2 liner w/a third for tabs.

                  Instead of a top and bottom bar for useful functions (putting some where I would use them the most, etc) I get their choices, which usually do not go well with my own usage patterns.

                  I agree with a lot of what you are saying, but the catch for me is not change. It is the absolute abandonment of previous standards. It is a forced hand for software that is used for buisness to change how it works. It costs time and money that takes a LONG time to recoup when the efficiency gain is marginal.

                  We have one project here that we have been forced to abandon about a days worth of productivity because a lot of the formwork/macros/styles are not 100% compatible. That is not even talking about the learning curve of the tech and admin staff.

                  All this to make you able to do things 5% faster in the long run is a wash.

                  LONG story short. Do what you want with the interface, but allow a few of the non-default settings to be able to imitate the old GUI. Leave them off the default, but able to be turned on if you want AND you know where to look in options/settings.


                  • #10
                    Man!! I do Excel for a living. Don't even get me started...


                    • #11
                      Then the option becomes bloat.

                      Just like the Classic Windows Theme no longer exists in Win7 either.

                      You can only leave the 'old' in there for so long.

                      I still disagree with your philosophy on it.
                      Where's my redeemer? INCOMING! I'M HIT! I'MA COMIN' BACK!
                      Originally posted by Ranshackle
                      I like Hasselhoff's ass better.


                      • #12

                        Since when is a meg of code bloat? :P


                        • #13
                          When you consider all of the code for the entire suite, it's pracitcally a needle in a haystack.

                          To you it's a meg of code, a "simple feature".
                          To usability people, it's like wings on an elephant.
                          To programmers, it's more obsolete crap to maintain, something you risk breaking with every code check-in.
                          To QA people, it's one more thing to add to the thousands of things you need test with every release/patch/fix.

                          Yes, indeed. It is one meg of code, and that one meg of code lends to hours and hours of headaches for the manufacturer.

                          I understand you have a unique vision and/or perception of things as the end-user, but there is a whole other world you don't see when you're all "clickety-click" on stuff.
                          Where's my redeemer? INCOMING! I'M HIT! I'MA COMIN' BACK!
                          Originally posted by Ranshackle
                          I like Hasselhoff's ass better.


                          • #14
                            Uhhh..the end user's "unique" perception of things is that he's the ****ing customer--the whole reason the software was written in the first place. If you don't care to give him what he wants, what's the point?

                            Why put a stereo in a car? It's just one more thing to break under warranty. One more thing to distract the driver. More load on the alternator to kill our CAFE. Let the user hum to himself.
                            National Sarcasm Society
                            "Like we need your support."


                            • #15
                              I understand where you are coming from, but look how popular the Dvorak keyboard is.

                              PERFECT example of something that may be more efficient, but since most people are used to using the classic QWERTY it never really took hold.

                              Something like this is even easier to maintain in that it is optional, the commands are the same (98% of them are) and all of the graphic resources have already been defined/made. They are not re-inventing the wheel shift, merely giving you the option of doing it the way you have been the past 15 years (these menus were similar all the way back with Windows 95! Hell, 3.11 had similar menus! Some may use this as a reason for change, but when you are used to a gradual evolution of a system, you do NOT change it this drastically this quickly).